well, i actually agree with a lot of what he said there, but man, what an asshole. he should apologise, in a trench, after 6 days of no sleep and 5 firefights. in the dark.

don't agree that hannity "pwns" anybody here, there was no discussion, and hannity didn't even want one.

but man, what a hateful asshole. the thing about freedom of speech is it means you have to listen to a lot of bullshit.

What is it that you agree with? I don't think he said one thing he shouldn't be ashamed of.

he didn't try to weasel out of it.
he didn't rise to hannity's ridiculous "questioning" method.
he agrees "to some degree" that the military protect his freedoms.
he doesn't look at freedom of speech as a gift, it's a right.
he points out that soldiers volunteer for what they get and that is equivalent to a vote supporting the military.
he points out that not all soldiers join up to protect their country.
he asks "what are they dying for" which i think is a very good question.
he calls the army a horrible waste of our tax money, and i think in the case of the US there's plenty of evidence for that, i.e. if you really want to "protect freedoms" then it wouldn't cost taxpayers as much as illegally raping iraq costs.

Now don't get me wrong, the stuff about celebrating soldiers' deaths is disgusting, and I have met some excellent servicemen who do not deserve to die for a filthy rich man's lies, but this guy is right that we are not in a draft situation and therefore people who join up are effectively supporting the status quo, which he has a right to disagree with. He even has the right to disagree in this completely retarded and disgusting fashion. You have heard the phrase "i don't agree with what you say but i will fight to the death to protect your right to say it" ???

Battering him repeatedly with "DO YOU REALISE THAT THE MILITARY PROTECT OUR FREEDOMS????" is juvenile, simplistic, and spookily similar to what some very nasty regimes have said to justify raping other countries. I have a soviet poster on my wall that says "Glory to the Soviet Army". It is written in Lithuanian.

Are you saying that the Army is a complete waste of money, of just that being in Iraq is? I sincerely hope it's only the latter.
Are you saying that it's a vote equivalent to supporting the military, or did you mean supporting the war? One should always support it's countries military. Citizens should never be mad at the military for what they are told to do. They should be mad at the people that tell them what to do (i.e. Congress)
Also, I'm assuming that you're saying that freedom of speech is a right, and not a gift. I think you should tell that to the Chinese. They can barely have Google in their country. In Poland,(correct me if I'm wrong, our Polish friends) you can be charged with insulting heads of state. Granted, these cases are not overwhelmingly numerous, but they do exist.
The fact of the matter is that the freedom of speech is only secured by a government that allows it, and has a military to ensure that no one tries to stop it. The reason that our First Amendment right exists is because of the restrictions placed upon the people of Britain those few hundred years ago. When they founded this country, they wanted to make sure that they had that freedom. If it was a right, they would have had nothing to complain about.

er ok point by point.

i am saying that iraq is a complete waste of money if your objective is defending freedom of speech. however, we all know that's not the objective (except hannity)

i am not mad at the military for following orders, i am not mad! but i do question the idea of volunteering to do the emperor's bidding... i am not sure that is what protects free speech in the world.

the chinese have a basic human right to free speech, they are just not permitted to exercise it. i don't think the US army should go over there and give them the "gift" of free speech. That's not how I would word it. This is semantics.

Iraqi babies have a right not to be bombed to shit, a right that in some cases has been denied them by the US/Royal Air Force.

What i take issue with is Hannity's retarded assertion that "the military fights to protect your freedom so how dare you criticise them?"
it's stupid, i mean what are you saying, freedom of speech has limits? They fought for your freedoms but you shouldn't actually exercise your freedoms?

The military, as far as i can see, is duped into fighting for the King's Treasury, now as it always has been.

But that doesn't mean i agree with this asshole, he is an asshole, and celebrating the death of a human being is repulsive, whether it's a US soldier or Saddam Hussein.

But they aren't fighting for the King! We're a democracy! </sarcasm>

I rofl'd at "Iraqi babies have a right not to be bombed to shit"..But anyway, yes, you make valid points. Humans do have a right to freedom of speech, but no, it's not always permitted. What I meant up there ^ ^ was not that we don't have a right to freedom of speech, but that it is the military that upholds it and allows it to be exercised. Even now I wonder why I was there - sure, a good portion of the Iraqis are glad to see us and to have us there, but that doesn't mean that we should just go into, say, N. Korea to free them from oppression. I've been there (Iraq), and I don't agree with why we went. But the problem with this guy is that he's not bitching about the war. He didn't mention it once, save to say he's glad my brothers-in-arms are dying there. It's that he truly is a disgusting waste of oxygen.

Yeah we can definitely agree that dissing dead people is not good. I really only defended this asshole because of your title... Hannity did not pwn anybody, because he would have to actually engage in a discussion in order to do that. If anything I think this asshole pwned Hannity, managing to calmy state his beliefs, getting in some valid points, obviously not inciting millions to go out and kill babies or anything, never invoking God as an excuse... he did pretty well. For an asshole.

As for your personal experience, well I have literally served the Queen, even if I was only a cadet, and it was simultaneously the best and most evil thing I have been involved in. I know that most of the servicemen I met were very fine gentlemen, but I was always wondering how you guys just sign over your life and fight wars you disagree with. You even have to retain the responsibility to NOT follow an unjust order, and deal with the consequences of that... i think a lot of this comes down to the fact that war is so unimaginable that recruits literally do not know what they are getting in to.
but you say you are a former marine, and you're only 22, so i hesitate to ask what happened... out of awe and respect. i can certainly imagine many scenarios that would make a video like this severely raise your temperature.

i can certainly imagine many scenarios that would make a video like this severely raise your temperature.
Right you are, MINK. As far as signing up to fight wars I disagree with, well, I signed into the delayed entry program in 2002, and a year later I went to boot camp in June of 2003. At this time, even the hard-core lefties thought it was a justified war.
Knowing what I know now, would I change it if I could? No. It was a really great experience for me. Especially when I was in Iraq. A lot of those people wanted us there. I was there for the first election, and it was amazing to see the amount of people lined up at the front gate of the base to come and vote. Mind you, this wasn't the "green zone" where soldiers can walk around without body armor. I was at Al-Mahmudiyah. Also pleasantly known and a corner in the Triangle of death. And for anybody that wants to bash me on here (yes, it's happened before) please know what you're talking about, unlike memorare in that comment to me about "techs in Kuwait". I remember hearing that more people per capita showed up to vote than in the U.S. We've had democracy for over 200 years now, and most people don't care. They bitch and whine about things, but when it comes times to vote, they're too lazy thinking about whether or not they want fries with their next big mac. I honestly believe that we are doing good for their country.
Anyone can throw up the "destroyed infrastructure and schools" argument, and I'll be glad to discuss how we do every thing we can to protect and rebuild them.
Really, it boils down to this: A lot of Arabs have hated us for years. Now they finally have the chance to come and shoot us.

And as always, MINK, I thoroughly enjoy your comments and discussions.

And how's that for a title?

well, i am not a hardcore lefty, but I can tell you that I protested against the war with a million brits in 2003, it was the largest demonstration in British history. But not many people know that, because it was on the news for, ooooh, 5 minutes max.

as for voter apathy, well i blame the politicians more than the voters. if you make me choose between 2 idiots, my reaction is "meh".

anyway, it's good to discuss something on the internet with someone who has actual experience
nice title change btw

This guy is a known grifter. He try'ed to blackmail several people awhile back (they where gay but not out) then flooded the world with DMCA take down notes and failed. He has 2 assault and battery charges in the state of New Jersey after he beat up his 17 year old girlfriend at the time. Everything he says has more to do with him making you angry. The perfect example of what a troll is but he is one in real life.

real life troll... that's a good way to put it.

Wow, Hannity found a bigger prick than himself to "interview". Upvote.

I am impressed with your discussion. No name calling, insults, yelling. It is very nice to see it on the sift.

wow, thanks for reading, it was getting lonely in here i guess people don't really upvote hannity much, for good reasons.
maybe try another title change to:
Hannity found a bigger prick than himself to "interview"

Done annnnd done!

wow what has the news come to now a days. this guy just wanted to speak his mind and got shut down for it? so much for free of speech and thought eh?

*dead ?

This published video has been declared non-functional; embed code must be fixed within 2 days or it will be sent to the dead pool - declared dead by mkone.

*notdead *undead

This dead video has been deemed functional; it must have been accidentally declared dead - declared notdead by mkone.

Why does Hannity deserve to be insulted? No one explained that.

Nope. It's *notdead.

Only dead or deadpool videos can be deemed not dead - ignoring notdead request by MarineGunrock.

Why the downvote KOMMIE? You actually liked that guy?

MarineGunrock, It sounds like we were both in Iraq at the same time and in some of the same places. I was there during the elections as well and passed through Mahmudiyah a few times. Your story reminded me of my experience. I was sworn into delayed entry for the Army on Sept 11th 2002 and started basic the first day of 2003. My unit was deployed twice while I was in. The first time was when the war initally began, and the second was for OIF III. I just wanted to back you up as I agree with everything you said. Most of the Iraqi people I spoke to would tell me how much *better* things were for them since we came. We weren't at war when I enlisted, but I don't regret my decision to serve. I learned a lot in 4 years, especially the 13 months I spent in Iraq.

Christ, what a scumbag. I almost felt bad upvoting, you know? Like, it's a good video, but at the same time it's not *good.* There should be...like..."watch this video, but the content is actually evil" or "The Fox News Effect"

(/totally overthinking it)

Lurch, with respect, we weren't welcomed as liberators except by the Kurds, right?
I know a lot of people who supported the war because it was supposed to be easy and bring democracy. That hasn't exactly happened as quick as they said it would. The "end of major combat operations" was a long time ago. Some innocent iraqis haven't seen the end of torture. The justification for war turned out to be a lie. That is some serious shit.

QM... why is hannity attacked here? because he has the intellectual capacity of a grapefruit, and he could have done a MUCH better job of exposing this asshole, with a LOT less hypocrisy and attacks on free speech. Free speech is there so assholes can speak out and then be criticised in the open... Hannity is an asshole who speaks out and we criticise him. That's your democracy. Hannity is probably more intelligent than this but acts all righteous for the audience... doublepuke.

Regardless of what he thinks, I have to praise the guy for keeping his cool the whole time and knowing that Hannity wasn't worth losing it for. It made him look like someone worth at least listening to.

..if you'll notice the manner in which the guy talks, his tone and meter, his inability to answer a direct question, his posture, his eyes, you can easily see he is developmentally and otherwise disabled, batshit-styley, why enable the little freak?

and Hannity??? He loves a good freak show, makes him look more legit-

MINK, it seemed in the beginning that everyone except the hardcore Baathists were welcoming us. The Iraqi army was surrendering so fast we could barely keep up with it all. Most of them had no interest in fighting, and some I spoke to after the fact told me they were praying for America to come. They saw it as their ticket out since they weren't in the Iraqi army willingly. Now that it's been a few years, the situation is obviously more complex. While the justification for the initial attack turned out to be incorrect, I personally believe it's a bit much to call it lies. My unit passed through many training camps out there that were not setup for the Iraqi military. There were also areas of interest that supposedly contained weapons materials, but by the time we arrived you could see that the place had been completely emptied. There's a lot of empty desert out there with a lot of advanced warning of the war. I think it's highly likely that *if* there was anything there, it could've been removed before we arrived. Of course that's just my opinion. Also, I believe that had we not gone to Iraq, we would be experiencing the same trouble in Afghanistan. Right now, as MarineGunrock said, there are a lot of Arabs over there who have hated us for a long time and Iraq is the battleground right now for jihad. If we weren't in Iraq they would just go take the fight to Afghanistan instead.

This guy sent DMCA takedown notices to just about everybody after this video first aired, then ended up having to apologize for being such an ass.

^thanks for info!

and @Lurch, that's an interesting perspective, honestly, thanks. I don't really want to argue back too much because i can't say i have your experience.

However, they did lie, they fudged the truth knowingly, they cooked the books, they distracted everyone with talk of democracy and then smashed the place up and installed a puppet, just like empires always do.

...

If you knowingly or negligently tell lies, and then you launch a preemptive war against a country which didn't attack you, then you are guilty of war crimes, it's as simple as that. You can't hang the nazis and saddam and then go around doing exactly what they did (unless you have a big fucking army)

This history of that region is that superpowers come in and try to smash the place up, set the oil price, draw the boundaries, and then call everyone "barbarians" when they fail to see the light of "civilisation". I think it's that simple. New generations come along that forget the old. History really does repeat itself.

Question is... why did they give this kid the time of day?

For what it's worth the website has been bought out

http://www.forsakethetroops.info/

^answer is, so they can appear all righteous and repeat the mantra about the troops defending democracy, the best way to shut down any lefty talk about peace being the aim of democracy.

and about the site, they gave him MONEY? lol! i bet he will never try anything bad ever again!

If we weren't in Iraq 650,000+ Iraqis would still be alive.

Bush blatantly lied us into that war.

MINK, well I disagree with you on just about everything I see in comments here on the sift, but that's fine of course. I like that you can get civil conversations here that don't boil down to name calling and 200 page arguments.

Rougy, same as MINK with the disagreeing. Seeing your comments in other past threads, I just find your viewpoints to be so extreme on certain topics. Sometimes it can come across as frothing at the mouth rabid Bush hatred instead of reasoned logic. Bush did this, Bush destroyed that, etc...

Now I don't like Bush all that much as a president. I don't agree with everything he does. I just can't understand how people think that everything that goes wrong on this planet somehow came from some twisted plan of his. People (not necessarily you guys, just some I've seen posting here) seem to believe that Bush is simultaneously a bumbling fool and a criminal mastermind. The two just aren't compatible. Is he a great president? I don't think so. Is he destroying all life as we know it from a dark tower, cackling with steepled fingers? I don't think so either. I'll never understand how that one man can cause so much virulent hatred in people. The way I see it, it boils down to two simplified options for the beginning of the war. Either intelligence was incorrect and bad decisions were made as a result of it, or the president knowing concocted a plan to frame a foreign country for personal gain and has been managing to manipulate his way out of being caught by Democrats that have absolutley nothing but pure hated for him. I think given past evidence of our president's public speaking ability and general intelligence level, I'm going with option A.

Everything Lurch said there is fucking awesome. Welcome to the Sift, my newest ally.

Well Lurch I can understand how you would be confused, but your reasoning is wrong possibly because you lack all of the facts. I recall hearing plenty of reports that officials told the President and other members of his cabinet that the intelligence was not reliable or even fabricated. Intelligence has to be interpreted. The president and his closest advisers chose to interpret it badly. That makes him a bad leader. He is a bumbling fool at times and at others he conspires to knowingly lie to his country and the world about his government's activities. The two are not so incompatible as long as he has others to back him up and do the tough thinking. But the buck stops with the President so he takes the brunt of the blame. Though what that has to do with this video I have no idea.

"Either intelligence was incorrect and bad decisions were made as a result of it, or the president knowing concocted a plan to frame a foreign country for personal gain and has been managing to manipulate his way out of being caught by Democrats that have absolutley nothing but pure hated for him. I think given past evidence of our president's public speaking ability and general intelligence level, I'm going with option A."

I suggest option C:
The president's TEAM (let's not forget cheyney, rumsfeld, etc) told the world that Iraq was an imminent threat (nukes in 45 minutes) and somehow connected with 9/11 (because preemptive war is illegal), in order to further their own financial interests and increase their political power, because they are just plain greedy, as unprincipled as the Democrats who are afraid to oppose him, being as they are just the other side of a dirty coin.

The "extreme" reaction of people like rougy is barely equivalent to the extremity of rolling into a sovereign nation, protecting the oil ministry, building huge permanent bases, torturing innocents to gain false information to go and kill other innocents, employing thousands of mercenaries outside the law, awarding huge sums of money to US companies for reconstruction projects that never happen, arming terrorists with unmarked weapons that get "lost" and dropping depleted uranium on school playgrounds with no electricity or running water.

The fact that you have seen some positive things in Iraq doesn't begin to outweigh the outrageousness of this war. The fact that "fixing" saddam might have been an honourable thing to do doesn't make up for the fact that it was done dishonourably and there was no realistic plan for replacing him, and now the world has lost patience with America and your dollar is fucked.

I don't hate soldiers, I marched in the street to try and stop you being sent there.

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MINK, well I don't expect we'll ever really agree on the subject. People tend to hold their political beliefs as close as their religious beliefs. I was just putting out my perspective here since I notice the sift tends to be dominated by the opposite side. On another note, I don't think you hate soldiers. Never occured to me.

ahhh now don't get defensive, i wasn't attacking, just putting out my perspective too. the "hate soldiers" comment was comparing myself to this asshole in the video, i wasn't suggesting anyone suggested that.
and my political stance is not a "belief"... i just look at the evidence, and history repeating itself, and i don't see any evidence that the bush administration is to be trusted to bring democracy to the middle east. if you got some, i would actually feel better about the world and be a happier person. you could say i am looking for good news... when i find the word "halliburton" and "cost plus" in the same sentence i don't WANT to believe it but it's true, so i have to admit to myself that yes, bush is a greedy bastard who sends people to die just so his friends can make money. look at where the priorities were... oil ministry, permanent bases, installing puppet.

I had more respect for you than that, Marine.

WMDs?

I defy either one of you to post a link that proves Saddam had WMDs.

"Frothing at the mouth?"

You republican halfwits don't seem to understand that between 650,000 and 1,000,000 Iraqi's are dead as a result of our invasion and occupation.

You don't seem to understand that around 2,000,000 Iraqi's have chosen to flee their country and live in refugee camps rather than risk being killed on the murderous streets that we, the USA, as the occupying force, are supposed to protect.

"Sometimes it can come across as frothing at the mouth rabid Bush hatred instead of reasoned logic."

Well...call me out sometime. I'm more than willing, and twice as able, to prove you wrong.

This is pretty much what I meant by "frothing at the mouth." Calling me a Republican half-wit when I never even stated political affiliation, and I'm not a Republican. Even assuming that all people who are Republicans are half-wits. I don't go around saying you liberal idiots just don't grasp this, or all people with political views other than my own are too stupid to bathe in my all knowing light. You even go so far in other posts to suggest that conservatives are nazi's and should be moved to the bottom of an outhouse. You don't consider that extreme?

All the way back to the 1990's we had people on both sides of the political fence feeding us lines about how Saddam was building weapons and should be stopped. Iraq was even called the "greatest threat to our national security" back in '98. Many Republicans and Democrats agreed that Saddam had WMD's before the start of the war. Hell, Nancy Pelosi even said Saddam had WMD's and there was "no question about it." Only after the fact when nothing was found did everyone change their opinion. Hindsight is 20/20. I'm not against investigations into faulty intelligence or people questioning the government. They are supposed to be accountable to the people. What I don't understand, as I stated before, is how there are people who hate Bush so intensely that they believe he is some evil mastermind willfully plotting death and destruction for personal gain. You'd think he's the damn anti-christ by reading some people's opinions. I think regardless of political affiliation, whoever is in power will continue this war. Regardless of what any politician spews to get elected, I don't expect troops to be withdrawing anytime in the near future.

I also want to clear up something else. I'm not saying I think that the initial reasons for war were correct and justified, or that I'm going to "post a link" that's going to show you WMD's in Iraq. I'm saying I don't think the fault is as easily laid on one man's shoulders as many seem to wish. I don't believe many of the vocal Democrats are any less guilty, and saying they were duped is a cop out since they were for an invasion of Iraq all the way back to the Clinton administration. I think the mistake has been made and now we must deal with the inevitable consequence of a lengthy conflict. I also believe from a military standpoint that our handling of this has been entirely wrong since the beginning, but that's a completely different issue which I'm sure we will also disagree on.

More respect for me than what? What have I done offend you?

*waronterror

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