The commercial was filmed as a joke, but the business and doctor is real.

But was it ever aired? Cause it should be.


It should be.

well, it could be argued that the business and the doctor is also a joke

altho i would also say it is quite arguable that western medicine, outside of trauma care, is kinda a joke too

Ugh. There are two kinds of chiropractors: the ones who charge you to accomplish nothing, and the ones who are extremely dangerous.

The ones who accomplish nothing are the ones who pop your back and call it medicine. It's the same as cracking your knuckles, and it does not cure anything.

The extremely dangerous ones are the ones who claim they can solve non-joint-pain problems by adjusting your spine. Like curing your kids' ear infections.

When I hear "holistic" and see a chiropractor wearing dentist gloves and examining your teeth, I think it's the extremely dangerous kind. I *hope* it's a joke.

@criticalthud - Pretty much completely eradicating smallpox and polio, rabies is no longer a death sentence, there has been a 55% reduction in cardiovascular disease fatalities since the fifties, there is a 90% childhood leukemia survival rate, transplants, bacterial infections are generally no longer a big deal...

This is just what comes to me off the top of my head, with research I could go on for hours.

Of course there are flaws and in some cases corruption in western medicine just as you would expect with any such massively complex and lucrative human endeavor, but trying to equate it with the blatant quackery of "alternative medicine" only displays your intentional ignorance of reality and makes you the butt of any joke.

I have no patience for this kind of mindless drivel. Somehow, it has become trendy to ignore the benefits of modern medicine. Honestly, I don't care if you die needlessly of cancer because you waited too long to see some western doctors, but when scum like you try to contribute to the general atmosphere of rampant unfounded mistrust of science based techniques that have an astoundingly successful track record, then you are trying to spread your inane poison and I have to reprimand your idiocy.




http://www.oxfordscholarship.com/view/10.1093/acprof:oso/9780195150698.001.0001/acprof-9780195150698-chapter-18

http://www.cancer.org/cancer/news/news/childhood-leukemia-survival-rates-improve-significantly

Girl @0:37 is dead now; head fell off.

Srsly though, that was the one that made me go ooh. I don't believe in the more "magical" properties of chiropractic, but I would like to try being adjusted.

Find one who uses stretches and massage, one that starts with an MRI or Xray, and above all, one that doesn't crack anything.

Or you could just go to a massage therapist and take the gamble out of it.

Ryan Lee, Chi-ro-prac-tic centeeeeerrrrrrrr, gentile, coomfortable, profesionaaaaaaaaallll!

Catchy jingle....Never would I pay this guy to crack me-

Yoga, swimming, Pilates...The body self-adjusts constantly, keep the temple flexible.

chiro is such a crock of shit... they should co-treat with homeopathics

are you an md? if you are, the number of patients you see, the treatments you can provide, and what drugs you deal are dictated by insurance and pharmaceutical companies, and you have no choice but to comply while you pay off your 200k in loans.
Do you know what iatrogenic death means, or what the rate of iatrogenic death is? check it out....
There is plenty of quackery in the western md world.

as for Chiropractic, at least they are attempting to address the most glaring hole in western medicine: the rather obvious relationship between the structure of the body and the function of the body.

And when it comes to somatic/structural issues - which make up over 50% of hospital visits, and of which the western world treats with drugs or surgery, the chiro's at least have some of the theory correct, it's just their methodology that is fucked.

But, as for fundamental quackery, let's look at how the western world treats kids. First, hook them on sugar, then call them ADHD and give them methamphetamine salt (Adderol), followed by Ambien cause they can't sleep, followed by Prozac caused they are depressed cause they can't sleep, ...all the while they are raiding mom's medicine cabinet for the oxycontin or whatever opiate derivative they can find.
yeah, it's a JOKE. But we were trained to bow to authority, call the doctor god and worship the white coat and piece of paper on the wall.

I mean, for fuck's sake, listen to the side effect list of any major drug out there. really? that's "health care". bullshit.

Western md's shine in trauma, which was learned from our spirited attempts to have a continual state of warfare. for that they are top-notch. Anti-biotics were a huge deal, but all they've learned to do since the advent of penicillin is to make analogue after analogue, and they've stuffed so many people full of anti-biotics for just about every malady, that we are becoming genetically resistant to them as a species.
health care. yup.
how many of you out there can even afford this type of "health care"?
but please, do some research and go on for hours.

walk in to any drug store, which is an extension of western medicine...
and we have 4 main classes of drugs:
sugar
alcohol
tobacco
and prescription pharmaceuticals

the question is, which one kills you the fastest?

and what sort of profit incentive is there to keep you mired in your shitty health habits?

so @shveddy, who is reprimanding me for my "idiocy", would you please explain?

Just to be clear, Chiropractic care is VERY MUCH "Western" medicine. It is a bit over 100 years old, but just as much pseudo-science as the grand-daddy of quackery, Homeopathy.

There are many practitioners that mix it with non-quackery, like Physical Therapy and Massage Therapy. There are some that mix it with traditional "Eastern" medicine, like acupuncture and herbal medicines. But that doesn't reduce it's quackery.

And certainly, there are many questionable practices in non-alternative medicine, especially with behaviorally-difficult children. But it isn't their fault that there is medication that lessens the severity of these outbursts. Don't blame the doctors for giving parents what they ask (and pay) for. Blame the parents who are looking for a quick fix, rather than spending time with their kids to fix the real issues. These are cultural issues, not specifically issues with the medical establishment, the same as obesity and diabetes.

The true way to tell if someone really understands alternative medicine's issues with mainstream medicine is to bring up Chiropractic care. If they can fault mainstream medicine for treating the symptoms and not the core issue, and they feel like adjusting alignment of bones is better than a PT working to heal your body so it can handle it's own alignment, they're really just being contrarian and anti-authoritarian, Not actually being logical with their choices.

@hatsix
sure, Chiro is western as much as osteopathy is, but in the general scheme of things, somatic practitioners in the west are considered "alternative" health care. Chiro is good for acute subluxations. Poor for chronic. Most acute subluxations are however a result of a chronic misalignment that has suddenly become acute.

as for, homeopathy. quackery perhaps, but it also operates under the same exact same premise as vaccinations: "like cures like".

PT's operate under a principle of "strong vs. weak" muscles in assessing structure and prescribing treatment. Their general bent is to "strengthen" the weak muscles in order to stabilize the problematic joint. The problem with PT and any other therapy that is primarily concerned with relative length in contractile tissue (muscle and fascia), is that contractile tissue is a "reactive" system in the body rather than control. The control lies within the neurology. PT has thus been shown to be of limited effectiveness.

and, btw, the garbageman has done more for stopping the spread of disease than the doctor.

Is he a dentist too or just likes to shove fingers in your mouth?

I won't argue that Chiro makes your joints feel better, Cracking my knuckles makes my knuckles feel better too... but it doesn't make them better. It doesn't "heal" anything, and that is alternative medicine's "Big Issue" with "Allopathic" medicine. You will ALWAYS, 100% guaranteed, get better care from a Physical Therapist, as they're there to ensure your body gets strong enough to heal itself. They can handle "acute adjustments" as well, but they prefer the holistic solution. The best part is, they have a proper understanding of the body, instead of all of the quackery mumbo-jumbo that Chiropractic Practitioners are taught (note: not all believe it, but they aren't taught anything else).

If you want to boil down how vaccines work into three words, sure, you might pick those three... but if you pick four, you'd get a very different phrase: "learn from dead things". But the main difference between vaccines and homeopathy is that we have an excellent understanding of what and why vaccines work, while homeopathy has never been validated by an impartial study. Sure, the premise started the same, but then doctors and scientists actually put work into verifying and validating how vaccines work. They made up new and interesting phrases to describe what was going on, just like homeopathy and it's "water memory", but unlike homeopaths, they reproduced their findings in labs across the country before they started selling it.

Homeopathy and Proper Medicine are as similar as me and the guy that wins a marathon. We both started the race... Sure, I was distracted after a block because I realized I could take a cab to the nearest restaurant and have a nice dinner and a beer, then I watched some TV, and took a cab back to the finish line and crossed it a couple hours later... But hey, we're both the same thing because we started at the same place, right?

The garbage man? I think you mean sanitation, specifically as it relates to bodily wasted, which has been around for over 5000 years. Of course, there have been many advances over the years, and it was not taken seriously in most of Europe until the industrial revolution. But it's certainly true... this technology that has been developing for 5000 years has had more of an effect on human health in cities than anything Medical Science has done.

Of course, it wasn't until we had a good understanding of biological vectors of diseases (research done by "Natural Philosophers", from which sprung all of modern science) that we understood just how important sanitation is, and started real improvements.


TLDR:

Chiropractic Care: May make you feel better, but at it's very best is the very least of what a PT can do.

Homeopathy: Complete and utter quackery, bearing only the most vague and abstract connection to real science.

@hatsix
you tend to speak in absolutes.

Yes, I work in the field, studying, practicing, teaching, and researching for the better part of 12 years. I am now looking the relationship of structure and health through the balance of neurological space in a fluid system.

Not one single modality out there has all the answers, PT included, but there are nuggets of value in every modality. Psychologically, we tend to focus on the distinctions in modalities, but the true value lies in the commonalities.

...in my experience, i have found that young practitioners in any modality, full of absolute conviction and surety, are the ones most likely to injure their clients.
I find that the deeper PT's, rolfers, and massage therapists study and work by musculature, which again is a reactive system in the body, the worse their results are. The focus on muscle strength, length and size has a psychological basis - we are in the mechanical age....thus we analogize to this...seeing the body as mechanical, robotic...a system of pulleys and hinges, insertions and attachments. Our emphasis is however misplaced. We are 70% water - and are more accurately a system of pressurized membranes and relationship, where fluidity is at a premium.

@criticalthud
Yeah, I've been accused of that, but I blame that on the "arguing on the internet" aspect of things, rather than my actual mindset. For instance, as much as I talk up Medical Science, I still don't trust doctors, and in the last 10 years, have only visited to A) get a Physical Examination required by a job, B) get a prescription for a PT, C) Get innoculated for one of the bird/swine flu, as I had been sick for a week after spending a weekend at a "Gamer Convention" (PAX), where there were many confirmed cases.

But, while I don't trust doctors, I actively campaign against "Alternative Medicine", as I've seen many people hurt by it. I've seen one person poison themselves after getting food poisoning, because "like cures like", and I've had one friend commit suicide after they were convinced that the anti-psychotic medicine they were taking wasn't "natural", and quit it.

Whenever I think of alternative medicine practitioners and their criticism of Proper Medicine, I have one quote that sticks in my head, courtesy of The Big Lebowski:
"You're not wrong, Walter. You're just an asshole"

Sure, Medical Science can be improved. But you can't improve it by removing the science. You improve it by removing the politics. Remove the kickbacks from big pharma. Remove the groveling and begging for research funds. Remove the Actual Politics of Insurance and Medicare and Medicaid and VA Benefits. Remove the Actual Politics of the 'War on Drugs".

Those are the problems in our current medical community. But rather than attempting to solve the actual problems that we all agree on, most naturopaths are just treating the symptoms... working on the edges of society, and contributing to the distrust of the individual doctors, rather than the overhaul of the entire system.

And there are certainly many types of naturopaths. Of those that I've met (my wife spent three years in a "Traditional Western Herbalism" school, so I've met quite a few), most have problems differentiating between an idea and a fact. An unsettling amount believed that herbalism is effective because the ancient aliens that brought us to earth also brought us a dramatic and intelligent plant-system which was created to diagnose and treat all of our illnesses.

They believe that through meditation, they are able to connect to this awareness, and this awareness is what will tell them what to give their patients.


It's not the individuals I have a problem with, it's their poor education that I have a problem with. Some NPs can overcome the disadvantage of their environment that de-values scientific method and fact-gathering. Many MDs can overcome the disadvantage of years of de-valuing their own intuition.

But acknowledging the similarities between the two ignores the actual harm that is caused by alternative medicine. Alternative medicine shares the same risks as Proper Medicine, with the same chances of mis-treatment.... but it removes any chance of surgery or active treatment to cure issues. It removes the huge base of shared understanding, and replaces it with a very small base of folklore that has been accumulated through "give the patient this plant, if they don't die, it must have cured them".

@hatsix
so, u don't trust doctors, but that's "proper" medicine, and anything outside of that isn't really worth trying, cause some people you know had a bad experience, and now they can't get surgery. Ok buddy. good day.